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did you ever noticed that you ubb beomes slow with a certain number of members or forums. ?

i currently have 43 forums and 13000+ members and i think speed has decreased very much in comparison with my test board with 2 members and 5 forums tipsy

do you have the same experiances ?

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yeah, infopop ignores that and refuses to comit that there IS a problem with usual servers and large boards :-/ running my ubb on an dedicated server even made it slow as hell having 10.000 members, 14 forums and 1.1 million single postings:
due the fact that 'something' crashed the server once a week i kicked more than 300.000 single postings, deleted 0-posting-members, limited the search-engine to a period of just 90days (this sucks), switched the ubb-accelerator on and removed a bunch of real cool hacks (like the hithack, which is a MUST for my bbs).
not everything's quite okay but it seems that after these negative modifications the board runs more stable.
i'm absolutely not satisfied with the circumstance that infopop does ignore that there IS a limit of postings, forums and members on several servers. hey, they cannot expect that we do buy a sun or silicongraphics-engine just to make a real huge bbs run like a charme :-/ infopop should start creating some sort of list of most used servers and the limitations.
i've never expected that my bbs would be as big as it is right now but it was just a hope. now my technoforum.de is one of the largest and most famous communities for electronic music and it really sucks that i have to limit some features, that i have to remove some really important hacks just to avoid the weekly crash. so, infopop boycotts in some way the success of this bbs :-/

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heheh smile

They do say there's a limit, tho it's not hard-defined. A site can have 50k members and 2 million posts and run fine on a good server. One with 100 members and 1,000 posts will run badly on a poorly configured shared server - it just takes a good amount of I/O to run through the flat files and if your server isn't up to it, well... it's a hardware problem.

Whatever modifications you add, you simply gotta turn the php accelerator on - there's no reason to not do it, it helps a lot. A friend of mine runs a ubb that gets a couple million + pageviews per month, he didn't know why it ran slowly... I convinced him to at least start with turning the accelerator on tipsy

When you post threads like this, it would make more sense to include your server hardware/software stats... if you say it's a shared raq, we're gonna all chuckle tipsy


- Allen wavey
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technoforum.de: I'm sorry, what are we ignoring?

We have stated over and over, in public, that the more members you have and the more topics are in a forum, the slower things are. We never advise keeping more than 5,000 topics in a forum, and never advise keeping more than 20,000 members. Even 10,000 members is sometimes pushing the limits...

The same would be true for the number of forums, but that usually doesn't become an issue unless there are 50 or so... we had a case of a guy with 700+ forums the other week. Performance was horrible, and we convinced him to drop it to only 150 or so... Only, heh.

If your server is getting thrashed under Classic, then it's time to move over to Threads, plain and simple...


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Originally posted by technoforum.de:
yeah, infopop ignores that and refuses to comit that there IS a problem with usual servers and large boards :-/ running my ubb on an dedicated server even made it slow as hell having 10.000 members, 14 forums and 1.1 million single postings:
due the fact that 'something' crashed the server once a week i kicked more than 300.000 single postings, deleted 0-posting-members, limited the search-engine to a period of just 90days (this sucks), switched the ubb-accelerator on and removed a bunch of real cool hacks (like the hithack, which is a MUST for my bbs).
not everything's quite okay but it seems that after these negative modifications the board runs more stable.
i'm absolutely not satisfied with the circumstance that infopop does ignore that there IS a limit of postings, forums and members on several servers. hey, they cannot expect that we do buy a sun or silicongraphics-engine just to make a real huge bbs run like a charme :-/ infopop should start creating some sort of list of most used servers and the limitations.
i've never expected that my bbs would be as big as it is right now but it was just a hope. now my technoforum.de is one of the largest and most famous communities for electronic music and it really sucks that i have to limit some features, that i have to remove some really important hacks just to avoid the weekly crash. so, infopop boycotts in some way the success of this bbs :-/
Get a grip. please.

Accusing us of boycotting the success of your forum is just wrong.

Face it, you have 10k members, 1.1 million posts on a flat file based system and somehow you figure that you are neither successful or that we are "boycotting" you?


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The issue more lies with server configuration. A properly configured server is the key and a huge bonus if it is dedicated.

Crashes I would bet are more related to server configuration, patches and versions of modules being loaded and their limitations. Run only what is required to host your system.

Then there is the fact that if you run under Linux whether it be directories or folders unless you recompile the kernel 20,000 or anything is the upper limits. Sure it will store more but try doing a simple directory listing or moving files around and it will be like molasis if it even works at all.

InfoPop as long as I have known has always stated openly the known limitations of their software and when one should look at moving to a new product, in this case UBBThreads.

Prior to Hostboard's change to its back end we eclipsed the known limits 10 fold. You can ask Dave as we chatted on the phone for quite some time and even he did not understand how Hostboard was doing what it did on what was very little hardware back then. But a huge amount of resources were put in to understanding how UBB interacted with our server both on a hardware and software level.

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The fact is that there is no EXACT information about the limitations: hey, what's going on with that? Always talking bout limitations but over the past months no one was able to state exactly the FACTS, there's no one single comparison sheet/chart to get an overview, what kind of server (cpu/ram & co) is able to manage xx members, xx files, xx threads, xx users online. It's just bull talking always about limitations and no one is able to tell me the facts, to provide me some sort of script which just tells how far i can go further on with my bbs and THAT's the reason why i'm fed up. I deleted so many threads from my archive, i kicked out so many members, i limited the search-feature, i de-installed a bunch of hacks and that's not the way i can satisfy my users in future:
THEY want more threads, they want a bigger and faster searchable archive, they want the hithack, they want more features...
being just a webmaster does not mean that i do have all data concerning the server but be sure, i'm gonna find out and try to get DETAILS from infopop about the future of my bbs. talking all the time about 'uuuh, ever compared ubb to other engines' is nice, but when buying and installing a product i HAVE to know all limitations and known problems and trouble issues from day 0. not after a bunch of years with a growing bbs and after kicking features and threads. it's also not the perfect solution to PAY AGAIN for ubb.threads. i guess even larger companies would love to know about the DETAILS concerning all limitations. i think it'S not fair telling the webmasters AFTER figuring out a bunch of problems that there are limitions, even not mentioning the exact amount of users, threads etc. concerning the different servers/cpu & co.

as THE next step i'm gonna try to find out all data about the dedicated servers (cpu & co) and then i'm waiting for an precise answer from infopop how many users, how many threads in sum my bbs is able to manage in future. THIS would help me to make a decision using ubb.threads or a software from another company in future.

talking all the time about limitations without mentioning the details is not the way a company should act. sure: there a thousands of nice and lil ubbs out there running fast and stable without ANY problems: but MY bbs is large and it is still growing. and i cannot tell my users stuff like 'please, limit your postings, best way: stop posting. the software cannot handle it anymore' :-/

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hehe, you can't get exact figures because they do not exist - you won't notice a difference in speed from 100 members to 200 members, and probably not 700 members - it's all in flux. While your site may have 50% of its membership posting 3 posts/day, the next guy might have 20% posting 17 messages/day/each, with another 40% lurking, and another 10% only showing up in the early mornings to post 35 posts/member/day. My friend's site doesn't get many posts, but he'll have 500-600 or so online at once during most of the afternoon, even when he moved to a dedicated server and then to threads, his server continued to crash until the hosts finally configured it correctly.

You've been here for years, surely by now you understand that if your forum begins slowing down due to it getting larger with more traffic that you have to either upgrade your hardware/software or move on to a database solution - it's rather simple. And once you move to a database solution (doesn't matter which one), if it isn't configured well, it could run even slower than classic.


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Allen's right... Don't forget that also if you get hosting from the same webhost on the same (shared) plan, it might have different speeds because of the other sites in this server (like UBBDev before April's server move).

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Not all servers are created equal, thats another part of the reason why exact numbers can't be provided.

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Some of the reasons we cannot and will not provide you with *exact* figures as to how many users will work on what server are -

We cannot account for hacks.

No two boards are using the same options.

No two boards are used the same.

No two servers act the same. We have stacks and stacks of servers here, all identical, all bought at the same time. No two of them run exactly the same.

In light of that it would be absurd to tell you "get this equipement, it will run a board with this many posts."

Because we all know that if the board or server had even the slightest hesitation running exactly as we said it would then who is the bad guy in the situation?


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i think you can't search all the problems on the server. we can turn it around and say: a good software will take the optimal maximum resources of a server, not a server will take them of the software.

i think especially the members database needs develpoment. if you have 20k members then you have 20k files, you now how long time it takes to access one file out of those 20k in one folder?

allthough the pms are a big problem. user register, write 20 pms, never come back. you delete their accounts but the pms still remain on the server. guess you have a board 4 years running then you will collect millions of dead pms (like I have it now).

concerning infopop about this the answer just was "sorry there is no way to delete old pms".

the admins interface should give out more statistics, so you can easily recognize where your board slows down etc. i guess there are many features which could be included in ubb to make it faster. maybe infopop also should think about to include some mysql functions for better management (maybe user optional like some other bbs do it)

as for the server. i run an 900 mhz Celeron SuSe Linux Server on Apache, 100% best configured and the server runs ONLY for the forum.

this was not a thread to bring UBB down or to complain about, i just recognized those facts and I liked to know what other users think about it (experiances etc.)

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2stamoulis, word! there are still some really necessary things to do concerning the serverload and the flatfile-databases like you mentioned concerning the privatemessages, the userfiles and stuff like that. nowadays loads of german hosting companies don't allow you to install an ubb anymore: back in the old times no hosting-service was claiming about that but today there ARE a load of webmasters who even aren't allowed to run a really small ubb with a couple of users and threads: so these users nowadays do use free php-stuff and that's a pretty interesting signal for infopop: users do not buy an ubb anymore because they even aren't allowed to install the lil' demo. i've been here for a very long time and i recognize that there's from day to day less interest in the ubb and even this very nice ubbdev.com-site :-/ so, something's going wrong. well, for sure, perl seems to be pretty outdated for running larger communities like i do, but: noone did tell me where's the max - "buy ubbthreads" wasn't the help i appreciated :-) - i still would love to get an email from an infopop-developer who would just check the server and tell me how far i can go in future with my bbs: AFTER that check i'm able to make an decision about installing a database-solution...

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Originally posted by Stamoulis:
i think especially the members database needs develpoment. if you have 20k members then you have 20k files, you now how long time it takes to access one file out of those 20k in one folder?
This would be an impossible figure to calculate based on the huge amount of variances given.

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Originally posted by technoforum.de:
i still would love to get an email from an infopop-developer who would just check the server and tell me how far i can go in future with my bbs: AFTER that check i'm able to make an decision about installing a database-solution...
The only technical way of actualy figuring out something like this is to monitor your server with extremely advanced diagnostic tools that would allow you to chart your servers performance over a period of time allowing you to gain a persective on the loading charateristics. Even then it would only be a rough estimate since the variables of the software are constintly changing.

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Exactly Steven, maybe there's a language difference, but I would think 'there's an infinite number of server setup/traffic ebbs and flows' would be understandable to most people. You can't get an exact stat for limits...


- Allen wavey
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well, is there noone else out there who also figured some 'problems' with a fast and too good growing bbs..? *g* - i know, i do host a really large bbs, but are there any comparable ubbs out there with as many threads/users i do have/host? would be nice just to share some experiences...

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While the current Hostboard system really can not be compared with, the previous system's architecture was not all that complex.

Old Hostboard server consisted of:
Asus twin P3 mother board (800mhz), 1gig ECC RAM, 3 7200rpm, 75gig EIDE hard drives running on a Promise Technology RAID controller (see note below), RedHat Linux 7.1, 3Comm 100mb NIC.

The server was configured with only the bare essentials to run the system (dedicated server). If it was not needed to run the system it was not loaded.

This supported roughly 20k users and 800 message boards under UBB v5.47

As for the Promise Technology controller, this was the biggest mistake I ever made in my 12 years as a network engineer in designing a server. Under Windows it runs great. Under Linux nothing but 1 major headache. The driver at the time (it has since been released as open source code so might fare better now) had major memory leaks and crashed the server at least once per week. As long as I remembered to reboot the server every couple of days things were fine.

If you want I will share my current networks configuration but it should not in any way be used for benchmarking nor comaprision to anything else out there.

But it is handleing around 3000 message boards and I am closing in on the 100,000th eek registereed user eek

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The driver at the time (it has since been released as open source code so might fare better now) had major memory leaks and crashed the server at least once per week. As long as I remembered to reboot the server every couple of days things were fine.
I'm running RedHat too and server crashes some times so I need to reboot manually, but I never found out why smash

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My current server is RedHat 7.2 It has only come down 1 time on its own in over a year and it was my own fault.


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